[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/bbcode.php on line 112: preg_replace(): The /e modifier is no longer supported, use preg_replace_callback instead
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4688: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3823)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4690: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3823)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4691: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3823)
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4692: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3823)
Lamma Forums • View topic - Foggy Ferries
Lamma.com.hk

LAMMA-ZINE - CLASSIFIEDS - EVENTS - GALLERIES - LINKS - Subscribe - Donate - Advertise - Contact Us - Facebook

  WHAT'S NEW? Bike Clearance ~ Lamma Island bolt-hole ~ Beautiful island ~ Lamma Guide
  WHAT'S ON?    Quiz Night ~ Art Breakfast ~ Game Night ~ Summer Camp ~ MTB Enduro Race
  LAMMA-ZINE:  Free Dining Coupons ~ Andy's Seafood ~ Wildlife Contest ~ Lamma Life 

It is currently Fri Apr 26, 2024 12:30 am

All times are UTC + 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Foggy Ferries
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:29 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 1:24 pm
Posts: 41


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:25 am 
Offline
Site Admin, Webmaster, Lamma-zine Editor
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2002 1:22 pm
Posts: 10011
Location: Pak Kok Village

_________________
Click here for Lamma-zine stories and recent Lamma Spotlights of the Week:
Photo, Video, Person, Wildlife, Bird, Artwork.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: foggy ferries
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 9:59 pm 
Offline
over 100 messages posted
over 100 messages posted
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:12 am
Posts: 120


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:09 pm 
Offline
Site Admin, Webmaster, Lamma-zine Editor
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2002 1:22 pm
Posts: 10011
Location: Pak Kok Village

_________________
Click here for Lamma-zine stories and recent Lamma Spotlights of the Week:
Photo, Video, Person, Wildlife, Bird, Artwork.


Last edited by Lamma-Gung on Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:10 am, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:19 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 1:24 pm
Posts: 41


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:53 am 
Offline
over 800 messages posted
over 800 messages posted
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:24 pm
Posts: 849
Location: Shifting Sands

_________________
Friends, Romans, countrymen, lend me your ears.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:25 am 
Offline
over 200 messages posted
over 200 messages posted

Joined: Thu May 19, 2011 12:47 pm
Posts: 234


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Green Island near miss
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:35 am 
Offline
over 300 messages posted
over 300 messages posted
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2010 9:46 pm
Posts: 363


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:24 pm 
Offline
over 100 messages posted
over 100 messages posted

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:04 pm
Posts: 196
Depending on the GPS (age and specific type) they may be only accurate to +/-30M. This puts you inside a circle 60m wide. Then add to the fact that many GPS take anywhere from 2-15 seconds to update, gives a bit of margin for error. ESP in the channel near green island, and when travelling fast.

Fog does not USUALLY have much effect on GPS. HOWEVER anything that obstructs the line of to the satellites can effectively lower the accuracy or cause it not to work at all. in the forest, under an overpass, in a building or tunnel. Also canyons are notorious, and the channel at green island IS effectively a canyon. Even Heavy clouds or Fog may completely block reception.

Radar often (mostly) does not pick up things low in the sea, Logs, wash rocks, small boats, lobster pot buoys, or cargo containers floating in the water. It may miss vessels completly also, the smaller and the less metal present the less likely to show on radar.

It is difficult for an island not to show but I was once looking in a radar when an island the size of Green Island appeared to our naked eye and was not on the radar. The first thing I saw was a tree floating in the fog, about 10m up. Fog interference with the radar, and a significant local magnetic disturbance combined to almost plow us into the island. Fortunately that boat only did 10 kts and we avoided it. This was before GPS was available to anyone but military.

All passenger vessels world wide are now required to use AIS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_ ... ion_System

It is a GREAT method of aiding collision avoidance in these conditions. It uses VHF radio waves in conjunction with GPS data for ships to broadcast location, heading, and speed info then the NAV system shows the ships and lists them by distance/time of closest approach to your vessel. Provided they keep going in a straight line!

I suspect that AIS, Radar, and the masters good sense to slow down avoided catastrophe in both cases we are talking about in this thread.

If you want to see something crazy look at the live AIS data for HK here. Choose area #904 and zoom in, it's crazy!

http://www.marinetraffic.com/ais/

The law of the sea is to travel slow enough to stop in the distance of visibility. I prefer to be able to stop in 1/2 that distance. I mean what about the other guy coming at me? Also required for power vessels underway in limited visibility to give one blast of 4-6 seconds on the horn every 1 minute. AND to reduce speed to the speed necessary to avoid collision.

I am an experienced sailor, powerboater, and navigator, previous holder of a USCG 100TON Masters License - and I prefer NOT to go out in less than 1/2 mile visibility period. Anything less than that on any vessel and I will have to consider - conditions, sea state, crew experience, electronics, other traffic, and anything else I can think of that might make me decide to stay home!

As I side note - By international law a vessel MUST use all available means to avoid collision. That means your EYES at all times, no matter what else you have.

This requires also that ALL vessels equipped with radar use it at ALL times.

Something I noticed that NO ferries were doing in the daylight when I got here. Until that one hit a concrete post with a light on it at Cheng Chau, about Sept. Starting THAT morning all the ferries I have seen are using radar 24x7. The skipper of that ferry is going to be in deep doo doo as he said he did not have his radar on, and therefore was not using ALL AVAILABLE MEANS TO AVOID COLLISION.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:39 pm 
Offline
over 100 messages posted
over 100 messages posted

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:04 pm
Posts: 196
I said to click area 168 for the live AIS data for HK. Apparently the area number changes depending on zoom level. You will have to navigate yourself to HK to look at the ships here. It's just google maps, if you can't do that then this whole conversation is prob over your head! LOL


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:29 pm 
Offline
Discussions Forum Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 7:06 pm
Posts: 5046
Location: Tai Peng


Attachments:
liveships.gif
liveships.gif [ 150.96 KiB | Viewed 2457 times ]


Last edited by Alan on Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:38 pm 
Offline
over 100 messages posted
over 100 messages posted

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:04 pm
Posts: 196


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:00 pm 
Offline
Discussions Forum Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 7:06 pm
Posts: 5046
Location: Tai Peng


Attachments:
liveships2.gif
liveships2.gif [ 155.82 KiB | Viewed 2455 times ]


Last edited by Alan on Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:48 pm 
Offline
over 100 messages posted
over 100 messages posted

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:04 pm
Posts: 196


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 5:32 pm 
Offline
over 200 messages posted
over 200 messages posted

Joined: Thu May 19, 2011 12:47 pm
Posts: 234


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 1:24 pm
Posts: 41


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: foggy ferries
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 12:14 am 
Offline
over 100 messages posted
over 100 messages posted
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:12 am
Posts: 120


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 11:58 am
Posts: 52
Was on the same ferry, also wondering this!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:11 pm 
Offline
Site Admin, Webmaster, Lamma-zine Editor
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2002 1:22 pm
Posts: 10011
Location: Pak Kok Village
Sorry, despite me following up several times, I'm still waiting for a reply from HKKF to my "media enquiry" to their GM and their PR people:

1. What happened this morning exactly? Where? When?
2. What measures were taken to prevent the collision?
3. Have the passengers been informed throughout the incident?
4. Why did this happen at all? Don't your ferries have radar, GPS or other devices to prevent all collisions?
5. What will you do in future to prevent this from happening again in foggy conditions or at night?

_________________
Click here for Lamma-zine stories and recent Lamma Spotlights of the Week:
Photo, Video, Person, Wildlife, Bird, Artwork.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:06 pm 
Offline
Site Admin, Webmaster, Lamma-zine Editor
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2002 1:22 pm
Posts: 10011
Location: Pak Kok Village
Finally, after several reminders and feeling like having to pull somebody's teeth out against their will, I got replies from HKKF:

1. What happened this morning exactly? Where? When?

On 6 March 2012, at about 08:50, because of foggy weather, the coxswain of the ferry from Yung Shue Wan to Central kept left of his lane to keep away from the land to avoid a collision. On the other hand, the coxswain of the ferry from Central to Yung Shue Wan also kept left of his lane to keep away from other ships.
During the journeys, when they were aware of each other through the radars, they made soundings to signal each other and slowed down their ferries to avoid collision. After investigation, they tried every means to avoid collision in this case, so they found no crucial mistakes.

2. What measures were taken to prevent the collision?

Both coxswains used soundings to signal each other and slowed down their ferries to avoid collision.

3. Have the passengers been informed throughout the incident?

No passenger was informed because the coxswains thought no accident was happening and they had tried every means to avoid collision.

4. Why did this happen at all? Don't your ferries have radar, GPS or other devices to prevent all collisions?

All of our ferries are equipped with AIS and radars to prevent collisions. The radars at the time worked properly, and the captains found no crucial mistakes after investigation. But we are waiting for their thorough report before making final conclusions.

5. What will you do in future to prevent this from happening again in foggy conditions or at night?

We will remind our coxswains once again to raise their awareness during foggy weather.

Thank you again for raising your concerns.

_________________
Click here for Lamma-zine stories and recent Lamma Spotlights of the Week:
Photo, Video, Person, Wildlife, Bird, Artwork.


Last edited by Lamma-Gung on Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC + 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group